The HDC experience
Due to a lack of formal trials of the effects in humans of taking Hymenolepis diminuta cysticercoids (HDC), anecdotal reports from users and their suppliers are all that we have to go on at the present time.
This page should be read in conjunction with Self-treating with HDC.
Side effects[edit | edit source]
Some people experience no side effects after taking doses of HDC[edit | edit source]
I treat my 7 year old (started treatment at 6, now taking 10 every 2 weeks) for allergies and psoriasis, and she has never experienced any negative side effects.
Side effects are commonly experienced during the first few days[edit | edit source]
I've had a slightly upset stomach and some sweats... [5]
Day 5 of HDC introduction for ulcerative colitis (dose of 30 HDC) and I gotta say, it's a rocky ride… [6] Unusually painful cramping, more frequent bathroom trips with longer stays, even worse sleeping due to pain and bathroom trips. [7]
I tried 30 HDC… Very fast like 24 hr later I got terrible diarrhea with a terrible smell. I never smell something like that and I suppose it is the so called industrial smell people speak off… My diarrhea lasted like 2 full days (also at night) but then things got better and normal again in let's say 6 days… I must say I did not see also aggravation of anything else than this diarrhea. [8]
I had an uneasy stomach for about a week ... my stomach felt sort of "off" or queasy - like I was hungry but food did not help.
... approximately 1% of paediatric patients experienced severe gastrointestinal pains with the use of H. diminuta, although the symptoms were resolved with an anti-helminthic drug. [10]
With hdc I had constipation for 2 days after intake for the first 3 months. (Link expired)
I had quite the reaction (after a dose of 20 HDC). Unbelievable fatigue at three days, nose running for a week, terrible headache....
After taking 30 hdc i initially had a flare up of neck pain, then it went away for good. [11]
The response I had from the hdc was sweating, feeling sick but it was also especially agitation and depression. (Link expired)
I think it aggravated the anxiety component for me. Not sure why.
I took my second dose of HDC 8 days ago and have been suffering from insomnia. Nothing too bad just waking up 1.5 hours earlier than normal every day which is very unlike me. I took 30 the first time but this time took 50 just to see how I tolerated a higher dose. I have also had nasal congestion. [14]
I got significant stomach pain 12 hours after ingestion (of the 4th dose) and did not sleep well. I have bad nausea and diarrhea. HDC always flair up my joint pain for the first day. (This starts within the first 12 hours and lasts about another 12.) So overall the ingestion portion of this experience is not comfortable in anyway... [15]
One user has reported that, on the day he took his second dose of HDC, he got an intense bout of itching all over his body, along with the worst exacerbation of joint pain symptoms that he’d ever had. When he woke the following day, he was still somewhat itchy, but otherwise feeling fine again.
Side effects are often dose-dependent[edit | edit source]
The risk of side effects is increased if two species are introduced together for the first time[edit | edit source]
When two species of worm are introduced together by someone who has not previously hosted helminths, or not hosted for some time, the initial immune response may be excessive and the risk of side effects greatly increased.
Side effects may take a while to appear after taking a dose[edit | edit source]
One HDC user has reported that, a couple of days after his initial dose of 30 HDC, his GI tract seemed much happier (more well formed bowel movements and less gas/bloating) and that this was similar to the mild 'bounce' he experienced after his first dose of NA. But, then, possibly at around 10-14 days, his immune system flared, producing mild fever, gastrointestinal upset, body odour, nasal congestion and sinus pressure, plus fatigue and lethargy.
Side effects can reappear after each of the first few doses, but usually diminish with each dose[edit | edit source]
I had a very heavy reaction to my first dose (about 5-6 days later)... My reaction lasted about 7 days first time and ‘only’ 2 days second time. [22]
I had that flu feeling and just wanting to nap! I'm on day 3 of my 1st dose of 20 and 4th dose overall. I usually have side effects 2-5 days afterward - after dose 2 (10 HDC) it felt like a cold and after dose 3 (repeat of 10 HDC) I just really wanted to sleep. I'm a bit fatigued now, but that's pretty much it. Took me so long to get my hands on dose 4, I think I've pretty much passed the hump now, but even after that 1st wk on dose 3 I wasn't really feeling that great. [23] [24]
I normally have side effects days 2-5 that taper off on day 6 and they seem to have gotten milder with every dose. [26]
Side effects may not appear until after several doses have been taken[edit | edit source]
Side effects may also reappear after increasing the dosage[edit | edit source]
I upped my dose this month from the 30+30 dose of HDC (i.e., 30 HDC every 2 weeks), which I have taken for over six months, to a 40+40 dose of HDC (i.e., 40 HDC every 2 weeks). Increasing my dose did bring on some symptoms. Once again, I had flu like aches and pains, extra fatigue, and also some intermittent nausea throughout the month. Several times, I had to just go lie down for a long nap due to the symptoms. But the symptoms were really fairly mild overall, and not even close to a level that would make me contemplate quitting. [28]
This month I achieved the highest dose of worms recommended by my provider, 60+60 HDC (i.e., 60 HDC every 2 weeks). And I’ve found the wind, figuratively speaking, to be quite stiff up here. Basically, I’ve had some level of nausea every day this month. Sometimes, the level of nausea was significant. I’ve also experienced significant fatigue, muscle and joint pains, loose stools, and some burning skin at this dose. None of this has been enough to make me contemplate quitting on the spot, but it has been enough to make me begin calculating how many days I thought I could endure it, before I was compelled to drop back to a lower dose. Nearly every time I have increased my worm dose previously, I experienced a short period of side effects, as my body adapted the new, increased, level of worms. At most, this was usually only 3-4 days out of the month where I had moderate symptoms. But this time has been different. This time, I’ve had moderate to heavy symptoms every day of the month. [29]
In a few cases, side effects can persist for several months[edit | edit source]
I took my 6th dose of HDC. Now, I am in my 11th week of taking those. The only side effect that I have really felt consistently throughout the entire journey thus far is sleepiness. I would not call it fatigue because I am not exhausted at all. There are moments when I just have to fall asleep. This is a huge shift from my sleep deprived past. I would never sleep more than 4-5 hours per day in the past 10-12 years. Now, it is like ‘hey, I know you just slept 10 hours last night, but how about a 2 hour nap? [31]
The persistence of side effects is more likely when starting with a dose that is too high.
I used 30 HDC every two weeks, treating migraine with aura... brain fog and fatigue. My migraines have continuously increased in intensity and frequency since I started the therapy (means I had them every day), I developed a bad eczema and my whole body felt as if it was in an inflammatory state... I am much better now and the worst is over, but looking back, for me, it would have been better to start with ten HDC and slowly build up from there. On the other hand the results now are promising and I am glad about what I have now. (Edited from two posts. [32] [33])
Occasionally, side effects may be experienced after every dose[edit | edit source]
...we usually get some type of irritability/hyperactivity in our son a few days after dosing. [37]
My 3 kids have PANDAS and multiple food sensitivities and were started on HDC in June. Their initial dose was 5. They responded almost immediately… a day or 2 and my daughters tics were gone. We increased to 10, 20 and then 30. They began to have a negative reaction (increase in their regular symptoms) with each dose….which is normal day 3-7. So we decrease back down to 10 for the 7 year olds and 20 for the 11 year old and have remained on that dose for 2 months. We still have negative reaction for a few days. [38]
I started at 30 hdc 3 week apart and increased from there. Side effects have been minor, I get a bit of an upset stomach that lasts a few days. My last 2 doses were 100 hdc 2 weeks apart. With 100 the stomach upset lasts longer. [39]
In the beginning it was a miracle. After a while the hdc started actually causing flares and extreme joint pain among other things. [40]
In some people with mast cell disorders, the use of HDC (or any helminth) may be contraindicated[edit | edit source]
For more about this, see Helminthic therapy and mast cell disorders.
Individual HDC side effects[edit | edit source]
Changes in body odour[edit | edit source]
One self-treater has noted that his skin, especially on his hands and face, began consistently to smell subtly different about 2 months after he started hosting HDC, when the side effects were stronger generally. He reported that the smell, while not unpleasant, was somewhat reminiscent of butter, a food he doesn’t actually eat. [43]
Another HDC user has reported that, possibly at around 10-14 days, his immune system flared, producing mild fever, gastrointestinal upset, body odour, nasal congestion and sinus pressure, plus fatigue and lethargy.
Stringy white material in stool[edit | edit source]
Layers of stringy white material have been seen wrapped around the stool of a small child with autism for two days following administration of each dose of HDC. A similar manifestation is seen in the same child the day after taking NAC or glutathiohone, but these supplements are not given at the same time as the HDC. The child’s parent has said that she is not sure exactly what the white material is - perhaps biofilm, yeast or something else - but mucus has been suggested as the most likely. [44]
Re-emergence of old injuries and illnesses[edit | edit source]
A very remarkable side effect phenomenon that has been reported following inoculation with each of three different therapeutic helminth species, including HDC, is a "strange, mysterious and magical" reappearance of symptoms from old injuries and illnesses. For more detail about this, see Recapitulation of old injuries, illnesses.
Risk of HD maturation and persistence[edit | edit source]
In adult humans, HD die reliably within 2 weeks, or possibly 3 at the most, unless the host is immunocompromised.
Exactly what happens to HD once inside a human has not been studied in detail, but it is thought likely that it will respond in a similar way to how it does in mice, which is better understood. [45] The definitive host for HD is the rat, and, since this tapeworm is not adapted to living in humans or mice, it isn’t able to evade the human or murine immune systems, which rapidly attack it.
After growing for only a few days in mice, HD lose their strobila - the main part of the tapeworm that contains the segments (proglottids) - leaving only the head, which is very tiny (under 2 mm). The head can then survive for a while longer before it is expelled from the host, and its growth will be even more stunted (severley stunted) when the host is exposed to HD more than once. [46] (This paper includes a picture - Plate 1D - of the organism as it is found living, without its strobila, in a mouse.)
If the host is immunocompromised, either because of disease, because they are taking an immunosuppressant drug such as Entocort, [47][48][49][50] or if they are concurrently hosting a number of other helminth species, the HD might persist, especially in children. Hosting just one additional species, such as NA, is unlikely to cause persistence of HD in adults.
However, HD may grow to adulthood and persist in young children, especially if they are also taking immunosuppressant medication.
The following scientific papers have reported the maturation of HD in children:
- Hymenolepis diminuta infection in a child living in the urban area of Rome, Italy -- Full text | PDF
And there are several further papers for which there are no details in PubMed. [52] [53] [54] [55] [56] However, the maturation and persistence of HD occurs in less than 1% of children who are treated with HDC and, when persistence does occur, the resulting side effects - mainly gastric pain - resolve within one to three weeks after treatment with anthelmintic drugs.
The following report is from the parent of a child who experienced a persistent infection after receiving a therapeutic dose of HDC.
My son is 8yo with moderate-severe autism and severe GI issues. We used HDCs for about 3-4 months in 2015. My son developed a SEVERE infestation of the small bowel that was only discovered on endoscopic pill cam. There were many many worms, almost taking up the whole lumen. Prior to the endoscopy, he had CRIPLING pain for hours a day. Screaming. We thought it was worsening of previous esophagitis and gastritis until we found the worms. He was also taking Pentasa at the time (an anti-inflammatory that perhaps dampens immune function). So perhaps the Pentasa contributed or perhaps he had delayed small bowel emptying. Who knows. The whole process was a nightmare. He required multiple rounds of anthelminthics to clear the infestation. [57]
The parent of an 8 year old child who was given 9 doses of HDC during 2015 (4x10 HDC and 5x20 HDC) reported that a test carried out 6 months later revealed H. diminuta eggs in the boy’s stool, indicating the presence of adult helminths, but, as this and the following two cases show, even when HD does persist, it does not necessarily cause adverse side effects.
Over the course of 6 months, I took 12 doses of HDC and gave my 2 year old about 7 drops out of the pipette each time. Although she is perfectly healthy, I thought this would be a safe, prophylactic approach to lessen her risk of autoimmunity later in life. So how many she actually got, I have no idea and she never showed any side effects from her dose. I quit HDC two months ago due to lack of effect, so this was when she had her last dose. Then, today, an adult tapeworm showed up in her stool, about a foot long and ridged. (Via private message, July 2016)
I gave my 3 yo son HDC for 1 month. It aggravated his preexisting chronic diarrhoea at first and rather than pushing on we stopped the treatment. However, around 3 months later I noticed an adult worm in his stool on three separate occasions. It seems some were able to survive, though he was in no discomfort and actually his condition improved somewhat in this period. (Via private message, 2015)
See also[edit | edit source]
Benefits[edit | edit source]
Benefits can include mood enhancement soon after the HDC are taken[edit | edit source]
I like how it puts me in a good mood for a day or two when I first take it.
It gave what I would describe as "a sense of well being" that would last for about two weeks. [58]
I feel calmer...
The first day I take HDC it usually puts me in a really nice mood, especially the first time I did it. It's not exactly euphoric but I noticed it and counted on it... First time, (it lasted) 48 hours. Second time, 24 hours. Third time, 12 hours. Fourth time, 12 hours.
Occasionally, there can be a sting in the tail for those who initially experience mood enhancement[edit | edit source]
I’m 1 week in, and the one HDC impact that I can be pretty certain of has been on my mood. The first night and into the following morning, I was ecstatically happy, like totally giddy, and it was great. Then on the fourth night and into the following morning I was in the throes of an anxiety greater than I have ever known… I have never experienced the kind of hopeless anxiety that I did that night. [60]
I started with 20 HDCs, experiencing an enormous increase in energy - almost too much too fast, (BIG bounce, for 2 weeks), got almost manic and very aggressive. And then crashed, longing for the next dose like the next fix.
Reports by HDC users include the following successes[edit | edit source]
I have been getting HDC for the past 6 months for allergic rhinitis and IBS, both of which I have been battling for years. The improvements were amazing! I've been taking a dose of 25 - 30 every 3 - 4 weeks since September. Both issues are virtually gone when i'm on them. The effects seem to last for 3 - 4 weeks. I can tell when I need a new dose because my symptoms suddenly re-appear. Then when I take another does within a day or two, huge improvement!
We started the HDC in August (and) I have gotten similar results with the HDC as the TSO: he has no GI symptoms now and, except for a migraine condition that I am still working on, is almost continually very happy and social. I am going to be experimenting with much higher doses of HDC to see if we can improve the migraines more. [62]
Hi, I just wanted to let people out there know that I have been using hdc with great success for the last 6 mnths. I have lupus and myasthenia gravis and it has definitely helped. Along with hdc I do also use Hk and have been for three years., though for me it wasn't enough on its own and it gave me severe gi issues. I lost my hk frequently, but after adding the hdc I have not had that happen. One huge bonus for me is that I have had hair grow in that I thought was permanently gone due to the lupus.
My father... has something called Samter's syndrome which includes nasal polyps, chronic rhinitis, and aspirin sensitivity. For 20-25 years, he had little senses of taste or smell, from polyps on his sinus nerve, and had multiple surgeries to remove them. Starting about 6 months after getting HW (by then, he had about 50, I think), the polyps went away, never to return. He's had his taste and smell all the time, acutely, for now a good 31⁄2 years.” And added two years later, “Now he is getting the same efficacy from HDC.
Just an update...got my blood work today my crp is .4 and my sed is 24. Considering my sed rate was over 70 in oct that is amazing!!!!! (I’m taking) 60 every 2 weeks. In all fairness though i do hv confounding variables. I am using multiple treatments. Traditional and otherwise. But by God Something is working. I was crippled and almost bedridden a year ago and today im working and feeling great!
...within 48 hours of inoculation, I had a good and sustained resolution of bone and joint pain, even at 10 HDC every two weeks. [64]
The first time i took just 30 hdc, my pollen and dust mite allergies--which manifested daily at all times of year as histamine reactions--disappeared pretty much for good. This is technically scientifically impossible, but its true. [65]
I’m currently using HDC which i started using while on Methotrexate... (I am treating inflammation of unknown origin that caused a variety of problems including temporary vision loss.) Have had really good results and am off MTX and my inflammation markers (CRP and Sed rate) have dropped to normal. Have been on for 6 months, currently taking 60 ova every 2 weeks. Feeling pretty good,too. [66]
3 months after HDC, almost all my allergies went away. I would say 97% cured.
At ~1 week in, I've been having the most perfect and regular poops ever. [69]
My son had lots of weight gain but he was very under weight when he started. It made him look like what a healthy child looks like. [71]
I've been on 30 HDC per month (for the last 9 months) and it has made an astounding difference for my allergies, and chronic sinusitis & rhinitis!! This is the first year in MANY that I haven't had to get a steroid (Kenelog) shot for my springtime allergies, and I haven't been absolutely miserable - at all! [73]
HDC has had a positive effect on my energy, brain fog, and sleep… It's hard to quantify one’s energy but for months prior to hdc I had a regular mid-afternoon crash and I don’t have those anymore. Also I’ve been prescribed adderall to cope with work and since starting hdc I’ve reduced my dose by ½ and for 2 days immediately after dosing with hdc even that’s too much… I am thrilled with the benefits I’ve had so far. I was seriously looking into applying for long term disability at work and now I can handle it ok again. [74]
My blood sugar came down steadily with my first few doses of HDC, until I was getting readings of 70 (close to perilously low!). Then it normalized to 90-100 range (excellent even for non-diabetics) when dosing with 30 every 2 weeks. When a shipment went astray, my blood sugar crept up to diabetic levels again. The replacement dose arrived 2 weeks late, but brought quick relief, and five days after taking this dose, I was normal again. My blood sugar readings went down each day: first 130 (solidly diabetic), next day 122 (borderline), then 110 (fair), 103 (good) until today 100, NORMAL!
Started out (3 years ago) taking hdc 30 every other week. I have ulcerative colitis and I am nearly asymptomatic with this dose (but) if i skip a dose I start having issues. [75]
I've been taking 20 hdc regularly every two weeks for nearly a year and I'm introducing foods I couldn't tolerate before, where I'd become constipated and break out in spots on my face and body. I've been taking the odd scary food once in a while, with little to no adverse reaction. Then more recently over Christmas I only had a mild reaction to herbs (in stuffing). Only last Wednesday I had a curry with practically no reaction... I'm getting braver, but cautious. [76]
Within 24 hours of taking HDC I feel much calmer. That feeling lasts a few days, before it lets up a bit, but I still continue feeling calmer than usual up to 30 days after dosing, when their effects completely wear off… If I could regularly dose, say, weekly, I probably would see my anxiety completely resolved. [77]
(I have) extreme chronic eczema. In the last 8 years since I went off the steroid creams, I’ve had crazy outbreaks of rashes, hives, swelling skin, itchiness and red skin syndrome. It would come and go but always was there in the background. Sometimes, when I was in a flare, it felt debilitating, painful and uncomfortable. I took the HDC and it immediately calmed the severity of things, and now after two months my skin is better than it’s been in years. [81]
I have had excellent results from taking HDC in that my hay fever is basically gone. I started taking them in March and the whole season has been a breeze. [82]
Partial successes[edit | edit source]
I can still tell when I don't take HDC, so I know it's doing something, just not getting me over the hump.
It doesn't outwardly do a huge amount for me to be honest, apart from a lovely mood bounce for 24 hours each dose, and a slight decrease in joint pain. [83]
Usually it starts working right away or next day, then works well for 5 days, then I relapse pretty hard (sneezing and sniffling all day). Then in a few days the symptoms are pretty much gone again.
I initially had some success with HDC but the effect seemed to lessen as i continued... noticed results the first time and i only started with 5... The next time i went with 10 or 15... but it still worked. I think a few times more and i neither got reaction to it nor benefit despite also increasing dosage. I tried a few more times to be sure and nothing... I stopped once the benefits disappeared entirely despite increasing dosage. I guess i used it for a few months. (Edited from several posts in this thread: [84]
So all in all I had major negative effects at the beginning followed by moderate positive effects which are not stable. The positive effects are moderate. There is no improvement in some conditions but to have days again where I have good mood is very good and important for me. However this is not stable enough yet. (Reported at 13 weeks.)
I started on HDC because of seasonal allergies, miserable by themselves and also which led to colds a couple of times a year. HDC seemed to give me immediate relief starting from day 2 and continuing for several months. Unfortunately, I stopped them for two months before a medical procedure, and since restarting a month ago, they don't seem to be helping any longer. I can't explain why, unless it's the irregular sizes and frequency of my (home grown) doses, or unless they just need more time. [85]
And a few failures[edit | edit source]
... I’m on HDC and they do not seem to help with food reactions sadly, i was ready to run for a 1kg bar of chocolate in the name of science!
Further observations[edit | edit source]
Benefits and side effects may change over time[edit | edit source]
I started with 20 HDC every two weeks for 8 weeks, then switched to 30 HDC every 2 weeks, but the way HDC work on my body has changed over time. At the beginning everything flared up heavily, but then the HDC worked as a great antidepressant and cleared up my brain fog, especially during the first 2-3 days after intake. However, I also seemed to get more joint pain. (After taking abx one time, I lost the benefits and only slowly got a return of the antidepressive effect.) After 4 months, things changed and, now, for 2-3 days every time I take the HDC, I get pretty heavy brain fog, but less issues with joint pain. Then, about 4 days before my next dose, I get more joint pain, and pressure in my head after meals that makes me feel like shit. I may have mast cell involvement, and this might be the cause of these symptoms, possibly due to my mast cells having taken some time to start reacting to the HDC. (Edited version of the following post.) [88]
A few HDC users have reported a return of symptoms after deviating from fortnightly dosing[edit | edit source]
A few weeks ago, our shipment was lost so we were one week late taking them and my son went through a huge regression a few days after the 2 week mark. We can't be late dosing! [89]
Missed a dose, no fault of anyone, life just got in the way... Been w/o for a month. Horrific dysautonomia, which is constant dizziness, neck pain... [90]
I did once miss a dose for 30 days, and there was hell to pay on that account. My immune system went crazy for about a week, until I could get a new dose. [91]
At this point, I had been just over 3 weeks without any worms, which is just about how long they usually live in an immuno-competent human. Almost on cue on the 21st day without worms, I noticed my first hints of symptoms. “That was an odd sensation”, I recall thinking. Then, the next day, the wheels just fell off my wagon. I was laid up in the bed with muscle and joint aches like I had the flu with a fever of 102F. But I had no fever at all. Of course, my back and hip rheumatic pain had to put in their appearance also. I was in a real pickle for about three days, before I finally began to come to myself. I had three really bad days, then three somewhat more tolerable days, but I was still far from well. Old symptoms were beginning to return also, like stiffness in my fingers. [92]
Others reporting a similar experience include the mother of a child with Crohn’s who explained that he began to bleed on two occasions as a result of delays in taking his doses of HDC.
However, the benefits can return quickly once a further dose is taken[edit | edit source]
...within hours I noticed my burning eyes lessen and my breathing feeling easier... [94]
On their own, HDC are not always sufficient to achieve disease remission[edit | edit source]
The doctor who introduced HDC as a potential therapeutic organism has said this in respect of his own case.
After trying HDC, some people decide to supplement with, switch to, or return to using, NA[edit | edit source]
After I’d been taking HDC for a while and established that there is no extra benefit for me in hosting HDC as well as NA, I killed off the hookworms to see what the HDC could do on their own. Unfortunately, nasal congestion returned within 48 hours of terminating the NA, and this persisted to such an extent that, after 5 weeks, I was desperate to restock with hookworms. Within two days of taking a dose of 40 HW larvae, the congestion receded. In the weeks that followed, I experienced symptoms that are typical after inoculating with NA, indicating that the HDC, which I had continued to take, were not effectively modifying my immune response to the new NA.
A few HDC users have also switched to TSO. [96]
Having been on HDC for a while may reduce the possibility of side effects from introducing NA[edit | edit source]
I have effectively used HDC as a substitute for prednisone. It seems, since my body was already acquainted with HDC, re-adding HDC during the NA adjustment phase allowed the HDC to take on all those extra eosinophils being produced in response to NA, rather than those eosinophils roaming freely, causing discomfort wherever they may. [97]
Further information[edit | edit source]
For more accounts of both success and failure with HDC and the other therapeutic organisms, see:
For notes on how HDC compare with the other available therapeutic organisms, see: